[00:00:00] Welcome to Unpacking the Digital Shelf, where we explore brand manufacturing in the digital age. Hey everyone, Peter Crosby here from the Digital Shelf Institute. After a decade of rapid growth and experimentation, ecommerce for many is moving into a more mature phase, while of course still being incredibly dynamic.
[00:00:29] Many companies are finding that the new opportunities for category growth lie in establishing the best practices for omnichannel execution, and then scaling those capabilities while adapting it to each local market. Vivian Valks, Global Ecommerce Acceleration Manager at Arla Foods, has been at the front lines of that ecommerce growth curve at Mondelez and at Arla Foods.
[00:00:52] Now she is leading their efforts to level up their omnichannel execution, driving a cross-functional process across global teams and in every market, designed to improve the consumer's omnichannel shopping journey and drive better results. She joined Lauren Levak-Gilbert and me to lay it all out. Vivian, welcome to the podcast. We're so delighted to have you on. Thank you so much. No worries. Thanks for having me.
[00:01:17] So you have over a decade of ecommerce experience, seen a lot, connecting the dots between departments in your organization, and you've been in multiple different functions across that spectrum from global to local to shopper marketing. And particularly sort of compelling right now as you're working on a project at Arla Foods on improving omnichannel execution there.
[00:01:41] And we'd love to just dive right into that and hear, you know, sort of what you're, how it came about and what you're working. Yeah, no, of course. I guess it's probably good to zoom out a little bit first, right? I mean, about a year ago now, we started doing a couple of really big projects internally, of which one was around content, like, well, basically rolling out a new content vision. And the second one is that we rolled out a digital retail media framework.
[00:02:09] And I guess both of those projects really helped a step change what we did on the digital shelf. And it almost organically kind of led into a discussion which we had internally around omnichannel execution. So, I mean, long story short, when I was asked to lead in the omnichannel execution work stream, I mean, like, it was for me a no, no brainer, right?
[00:02:39] It's kind of part in our internal organization from a next-gen marketing perspective. So, that stands for next generation marketing. And when the discussion came up, it made only sense for me to invest my time into it. I kind of worked out a plan together with the team on like, okay, what does that then look like? And how do we actually want to approach omnichannel moving forward? So, that's kind of where we started. And then from there, it's been evolving.
[00:03:08] Oh, my gosh. I have so many questions. So, first, I'd love to, one, next-gen marketing, it does feel like we are at an inflection point in the marketing practices and execution and strategies that you need to be good at in order to reach consumers and to influence them and all of that.
[00:03:36] And I'd love just sort of your, you know, to the degree you can share, like, what's driving that overall initiative? And is it sort of driven around that kind of just all the shifts and how we can, how we need to connect with consumers? Yeah, I'd love to just get that. Yeah, it's very fair. And I think it's a multi-dollar question, right? I think in general, next-gen marketing for me goes way beyond me in that sense. It's much bigger. It's like, it's led by our transformation team in general.
[00:04:05] And as part of that, omni-channel execution is kind of one of the sub-work streams related to that. And that's where I kind of come in and where, of course, the digital world is super relevant because as e-commerce or digital experts, we are often driving that omni-channel transformation because it's almost like the missing link to the traditional organization in order to facilitate that transformation.
[00:04:34] And Vivian, so, I mean, from where you sit now in the role that you have, did you have just a digital focus or did you, are you the one that's kind of like quarterbacking omni-channel across the organization? And what, if you're, if someone is listening to this and they're trying to build out an omni-channel team, like, how would you try to explain how you got to this point? Yeah.
[00:04:59] I think how we went about it is indeed, I mean, and this is where I was saying before, like, it's almost like an organic evolution, right? So it's, I mean, if you're setting out guidance and some new visions around e-commerce or digital shelf kind of strategies, for me, it goes hand in hand with approaching it more from a category perspective. And that rolls into like having conversations with cross-functional departments.
[00:05:29] So that's really how it started. It started from setting out a content vision where I felt the urge to connect with the marketing department, which then led into conversations with the next-gen marketing team, which led into conversations into digital retail media, et cetera. So for me, that's really the enabler. Start reaching out to your cross-functional colleagues in the business, show them like the
[00:05:56] world they're not too familiar with and the kind of longer term vision you have, because that for me was the big enabler to get this off the ground. I hear the sound of crumbling silos. I love that sound. I know, we do. It's not rocket science, is it? But again, it's definitely key to success. Yeah. Sorry, go ahead, Lauren.
[00:06:23] I was just going to say, so you talked about some of those cross-functional partners. And then as you're going through this project and you're working with your cross-functional partners, how are you actually measuring success of the project and just the program overall for you and for each of those teams that are dedicating time to the initiative? Yeah. I guess the key to success is a combination of a couple of different pillars, right?
[00:06:48] So one is I think you need someone to lead the project who has a big passion for it, because I mean, it's often on top of everyone's day job anyway, right? So you've got someone who keeps on investing time and energy into it to streamline the whole thing. Then on top of that, you need a truly cross-functional team to be part of it, because otherwise you end up thinking again in your own little silo.
[00:07:14] So it's important to make sure the people you gather around you have different areas of expertise which they bring, because in that way you can really almost break through the kind of tunnel vision other people might have. And I think with any project or good project management skills, it's having a clear plan, being realistic as well about it, and including proper approval and feedback loops into it.
[00:07:46] And do you have specific metrics around the number of projects that you've kicked off with the number of people involved? Is there any tangible metric that you're using to help measure that outside of the cross-functional collab? In all honesty and transparency, I would say it's a journey for us as well. So I mean, we're learning on the go, so we're adapting as well.
[00:08:09] And I think that's what you need to be able to do, because I can guarantee you that if you start off a project like that, a couple of months down the line, the plan needs to be adjusted. And I think you need to have that agility and that flexibility in order to be successful. So that goes the same with the KPIs, right? Like, they might be fine-tuned over time. So I mean, I think one of the other, like, and it's not so much a hard KPI, but it's more
[00:08:38] like the approach around it. How do I say? Like, it's, I think the risk is if you kick off a project like this, which usually happens on a global perspective is that you kind of lose the connection to the local businesses. So what we've done as well in the work stream group is we made a combination or like we try to have a right balance between having global people, but also local people.
[00:09:03] Because, I mean, in a more mature organization, the KPIs are going to be different versus less mature organization or business. So it's constantly about adapting and making sure it's kind of almost fit for purpose, no matter where in the journey you are. I'd love to know if, and I don't know if you have it off the top of your head, but whatever
[00:09:29] sort of strategy paper you put together for this, is there a way in which you, at the top of it, sort of said what you wanted your outcome to be? Like, what transformation should look or feel like, either to Arla Foods folks and outcomes or to what the consumer or your customers should feel? Do you, is there an easy way to describe that? I know it's probably a complex bit. Yeah. And I guess without giving too much away, right?
[00:09:57] Like, I guess it starts with having a clear objective internally. I mean, that's what we started from, right? What is the objective? What is the key challenge? From there, we then identified a couple of key deliverables. Going from, like, thought leadership into, like, tools and executional purposes, but also including, like, capability building. So those three kind of almost deliverables were extract, if you can say so, of, like, the
[00:10:26] objective and the challenges we are facing. And that kind of set for us the foundation in order to, one, put the team together, but also work out the actual action plan on the back of it. And Vivian, you talked about the global-local relationship, which anybody who's listening knows there's a level of complexity to the global and the local relationship because you're activating in the region, but you still have the global team.
[00:10:51] Can you talk about how that relationship works in the org and how it can benefit an omni-channel operations project like this? Having both a global and a local place in the project, if that makes sense. So, and this goes, like, layer per layer, I would say. So there's different elements to an omni-channel, having an omni-channel approach, which probably requires slightly different perspectives.
[00:11:20] So to give a bit of examples, I would say from a capability-building perspective, I think you can most likely tackle it from a global perspective, but then adapt it slightly to, like, local nuances to bring in really examples, et cetera. But if you're talking about budgets, indeed, like, there's processes on a local level usually, which really needs to be considered.
[00:11:45] So, I mean, you can set out, like, this global way of working or a process, but of course it needs to be kind of tacked on to, like, the timelines and the whole processes you have locally. So, yes, it's not a simple project, right? Like, it involves a lot of stakeholder management. It involves a lot of, like, sense checking, like, gathering feedback, testing it out. So, yes, it's how we usually start.
[00:12:15] We set out a vision, which is sense checked and, like, already inputted by local. But then you've got to do, like, a pilot, for example, to see if this actually works, generate the feedback and do, like, revise, et cetera. So when I think about what you're talking about here, and, you know, I was thinking of the teams that you talk to, like, marketing, digital media, brand marketing, shopper marketing, agency management, e-commerce,
[00:12:45] and then you have the people across the categories and all that. It sort of leads me to what we've been working with you on recently with the DSI and TPG, the eCAPMAN research that we did, eCategory Management. And that's โ I wondered if that's one โ if that's sort of one of those places of upskilling that you're thinking about that's going to fold into omni-channel excellence.
[00:13:11] And so I'd love for you to describe โ because you contributed meaningfully to the report, and we're super grateful for that. And I would love your perspective on this kind of relatively new practice. You know, they've been doing category management forever on the in-store side. But it really is somewhat the same, but a lot of difference on the e-commerce side.
[00:13:36] So I'd just love your perspective on that piece of opportunity that you've been seeing at Arla. Yeah, that's a great question. Like, I think in essence, right, I mean, eCategory Management is in essence โ like, the objective is not different from traditional category management. You want to grow the category because that's, in the end, how you drive sustainable growth, in my opinion.
[00:14:02] How that kind of becomes โ well, it turns into, like, really real-life examples. That's where it really is different just because the e-commerce shopper journey is so different from the traditional shopper journey if you kind of have a look at them in isolation. And that's also where there's, of course, different type of projects which are linked to eCatman versus traditional Catman. Just to give a couple of examples, like, if you look at, like, eCommerce content,
[00:14:32] that is something we approach from a category perspective. Think about the protein category, right? We've done, like, research on understanding what is more important for a shopper in terms of the communication. And those insights is what we then utilize in order to kind of optimize our eCommerce content. But it goes into all sorts of different key drivers or KPIs from a digital shelf. So it goes into search.
[00:15:01] I mean, if you search for butter, you're expecting butter, I'm assuming, right? I hope so. Yeah, right. I mean, it's a no-brainer. But what happens if a shopper then suddenly sees peanut butter? Yeah. I mean, it's a category story to have or to be had with your customer or your retailer in order to see, okay, I get it that, you know, the algorithm is picking it up like this. But from a category perspective, it doesn't make sense.
[00:15:30] The shopper is not expecting it. What can we do about it? And those are such, like, basic and vital conversations, I would say, to have. And that, for me, all sits under category management from a digital shelf perspective. And Vivian, one of the things I loved that you talked about when we were doing the eCatman research was your taxonomy reviews and how you actually built out a plan for your regions to understand how they could go through those conversations with the retailers. Can you touch on that a bit?
[00:15:58] Because I thought that was a unique approach for eCatman. Yeah. Yeah. So I think when you look at, like, customer requests out there when it comes to eCatman, I think most companies, like, will be known with this, is that it always goes into, like, okay, is the category structure the right one? Is the space planning, right? It's on the digital shelf. You can do the same. And that's what we refer to as, like, taxonomy reviews.
[00:16:26] So there's a couple of different layers within that going from, like, how is the actual menu on the website structured to, like, are products, like, dual-sited on-site in the right categories? It's, again, to that search example. Like, are the right products actually showing up when the shopper is searching? So there's so many, I mean, I could go on for a little while, but there's so many different layers to taxonomy reviews,
[00:16:52] which I think is important to kind of have a view from when you're talking about your own categories, and also have those conversations with your retailers. So what we did internally is, indeed, we kind of tried to help our local teams who have less experience in this space to set out a, that's what we call, like, the taxonomy review guide. But it's really, like, if you drill it down, it's a step-by-step guide on, like, this is the approach you should be taking.
[00:17:20] This is, like, the kind of information, data points you should be looking into. And even, like, if a market, for example, wouldn't have the funds or the data requirements to do a proper analysis available, we put in suggestions on how they could go about it to still make it work. And that goes back to what we were talking about at the beginning, right? And, like, the different maturities of different markets.
[00:17:46] There's no point for me to set out a guide which is not adaptable or actionable by local markets if they're in a different maturity level. So we always try to go back to the drawing board and say, okay, if you don't have any data available, what can you still do? And that's what the guide really goes into on those different levels. When I think about category growth that you've been talking about,
[00:18:14] it feels like, and I love your perspective on this, it feels like category growth, particularly in a future AI agent-led mission shopping-driven, here's my question, give me my two answers kind of thing, that more and more category growth is going to be getting more and more granular
[00:18:41] in terms of the kinds of consumer missions or the questions or the niches that might want to buy your product. And in some sense, stealing them away from your competitors. Because, I mean, the number of human beings in the world that are, you know, having eating protein bars is, you know, finite.
[00:19:06] And so what can change is, can you get them the one that's right for them as quickly as possible? Does that sort of line up with your thought about getting better and better at taxonomy and at the way in which you can search on products? Yeah, I think in a way it does.
[00:19:29] I think the real reason, I would say, why we would be looking into it for me is around removing the friction for shoppers and making sure they're able to find what they're looking for. Where in-store, they're familiar, right, with the path they need to walk. I mean, they often go to the same store anyway, so they kind of know where they're going. Online, this is different and is per retailer different almost like how it's set up?
[00:19:59] Yeah. And I also think, like, if your product, like, it's on the digital shelf, it's just easier to kind of get lost in, like, the massive amount of installment which is available there. Yeah. So there's a couple of elements in it, I guess. One is the findability. So through taxonomy reviews, you can be easily found in the right categories.
[00:20:26] But then it's also about the whole range analysis around it. And that goes back to my peanut butter example of, like, being present in the butter category. I can guarantee you a shopper is not looking for peanut butter when they're searching for butter. So I think it goes back to, again, having that out-zoomed view of, like, what is right from a shopper perspective.
[00:20:49] Because, I mean, there's hundreds of studies out there, right, which prove that if you have a journey online with less friction, it's driving conversion, and therefore it's also driving category growth. So it's not so much about, like, stealing it away from others. It's really about making it so useful for a shopper that they don't, you know, get distracted or they go to another retailer because they like the user interface better.
[00:21:17] And I think the key there, Vivian, that I want to call out, and you said it before, is that's a collaboration with the brand and the retailer. Like, brands need to have these conversations with the retailers so that they can change the taxonomy on their website, how they're thinking about the category. And all of this is connected to those joint business planning conversations where you can bring these insights to the table. And that's why eCatman is so important. So I just think that connection needs to be made for brands and retailers to have those joint conversations. 100%.
[00:21:47] 100%. I couldn't agree more. I think it's all about the collaboration and the co-creation of these kind of things. So it's about starting the conversation early out. I mean, understanding also the challenges from the retailer. Because, I mean, if you understand the challenges from their perspective and you kind of combine it with your own challenges, that's kind of how you, I think, find the balance between the two worlds and can find how you really drive category growth. Yeah.
[00:22:14] And that is what is so cool about this piece that you've contributed to that the DSI and TPG have put it out. And so I would be remiss in my role as emcee of this little show if I didn't ask Lauren, because there's the report itself. And then you folks have recently done, with Vivian, as well as others, a webinar on it. Where is the best place to go on the DSI site to find those assets?
[00:22:40] If you go to digitalshelfinstitute.org and click on resources, it's on the top row. The report is there. The webinar is there live. So you can view all of that. If you can't find it, you just have to type it in the search bar, eCatman, and it'll come right up. Search works. Who knew? We love it. And also... I was like, am I making it? Yeah. We also did a report on joint business planning. So a second plug. If you want to see how you can incorporate this into those conversations,
[00:23:09] you can search for JDP in the resources section and see how you can utilize that as well. There. My work here is done. I love it. So Vivian, we chatted a bit about agentic search and using AI agents and things like that. How are you thinking about infusing AI into your strategy to be able to scale a lot of these things that you're talking about? Yeah, that's a bloody good question, right? I guess that's like...
[00:23:37] I mean, that's the end goal, making life easier. And I think AI definitely is a key enabler for that. I mean, within Arla, we do quite a bit actually on it. It started basically with Arla rolling out their own Arla GPT system internally. And that kind of got us thinking, within eCommerce at least, in terms of like, okay, what can we do in order to make our lives easier?
[00:24:02] And we started off using Arla GPT to optimize our content on the digital shelf. And from there, we kind of rolled into, okay, can we then do some more pilots and test and learn? So we started looking into like, how can we create content, like visual content through AI, which is, of course, one of those topics everyone really wants to engage with. But it's proven to be still pretty difficult.
[00:24:32] So we kind of found, I believe, a middle way of utilizing it. So we finalized our first pilot in the Dutch market fairly recently. And we're now actually doing some pilots on like actual content testing linked to it. Yeah, and that's all like a result of our test and learn playground.
[00:24:54] So we have like this program internally where we kind of inspire and enthouserize like the eCommerce community to do tests and learns. AI, we kind of integrated as like one of those pillars eventually. But we also soon realized that it's actually like, it's way bigger than that.
[00:25:15] So even though we kicked off these pilots and we kind of started testing the grounds on it, we also said, okay, we've got to probably take it to the next level and broaden this up a little bit. And that's when we came up with our AI lab, which we're rolling out at a minute, which is super exciting. And it's meant to also bring cross-functional departments together. It's meant to kind of share insights across the business as well as within the eCom community. So it's a lot of exciting stuff happening.
[00:25:45] And I mean, we could probably make a whole podcast episode on this topic in isolation. But yeah, yes. And Vivian, where does ownership of something like an AI lab sit in the organization? Because I know everybody's trying to figure out how to incorporate AI. But is that owned by a certain team or function? Like how have you set that up in your org?
[00:26:09] Yeah, I guess what we're trying to do with an eCom, like we're really powering that in our community. But we've kind of opened it up for other departments. So it's not necessarily owned by eCom, but it's definitely opening conversations across the business. And then, of course, we've got like a digital board who is actually owning this kind of stuff.
[00:26:31] And because obviously, first of all, what you just rattled off in terms of how your company is leaning into this is so impressive. You know, we've talked to a lot of folks in the industry that are, and rightfully so in a lot of ways, are wary of it, are concerned about its potential legal and compliance issues. Is it accurate? Is it accurate? Is it not?
[00:27:00] Like so, and that, and understandably that those worries have made them more tentative about investing in it. And so I see little experiments happening, but this kind of, this, what I imagine is sort of a strategic, and you tell me like executive level, we're going to figure this out. And we'll take our time, but we're not going to, we're going to, you know, invest in it.
[00:27:27] That to me seems like a real connection of executives because it's IT data. I'm sure you're all of your analytics folks, like all these folks need to be involved. You're, you're, you know, chief legal officer, right? Yeah. I'm wondering if that's how it's coming, that it's more, it's both top down and kind of bottom up sort of. Yeah, I guess it's both indeed.
[00:27:51] So all LGBT definitely is more a top down approach, whereas like the AI lab is more bottom up approach, because I guess what happens is people get excited about AI, right? I mean, so there's, you kind of jump on a train, which is like, you can't stop. So we also saw the urge of creating playbooks within our community, specifically on e-com, for example, on like sharing limitations and risks.
[00:28:16] Because if people get excited and they want to start trialing things, I mean, you can't oversee everything. So that's why we said, okay, we need to speed up what we're doing in terms of providing global guidance within e-com to show what you can and cannot do. And that's kind of like how it all accelerated. I mean, that's also why we're an accelerator team. That's the name. I mean, I'm making my case, right?
[00:28:43] But yeah, so that's kind of how it all happens, right? And yeah, in order to do that, you need to be entrepreneurial and you need to be agile, I would say. So that's a specific mindset. But I guess most of the folks within like e-commerce or digital commerce, they usually have that kind of personality or mindset. So yeah, that's why you often see it happening within that department first. I love it.
[00:29:12] I just think it's so impressive. And to close out, I'd love to just ask you kind of a career pathing question. Because you've been in the scrum of elbow throwing, I'm going to make e-commerce from scratch. And you've run the business, right? Oh, well. Well, you know what I mean? You've had daily KPIs of this is what I need to drive. You've done the work there.
[00:29:42] And now you're in a global role where, and both are entrepreneurial in a really crazy way, but require adding way more, not way more skills, but such different skills to be able to do the global role. And I'm just wondering how you think about that in terms of, like, do you miss the daily, you know, I'm in this market and I'm doing this thing or I'm in this role and I'm doing this thing or, you know, I don't know.
[00:30:09] Just to what degree, I'm surprising you with this question, but I would just love it with thoughts. Yeah, that's okay. Don't worry. Don't worry. I love development questions anyway, because I'm a big, big believer of personal development, which I guess is also like kind of like sentiment to my own career path to date. But yeah, to answer your question, I think, well, one, I'm personally very entrepreneurial. I mean, I used to have my own business before I went into the FMCG.
[00:30:36] So I guess that's just something which is still very close to my heart and why it's kind of getting into my day-to-day work as well. But I also think, like, for me, to be successful in a global role, you've got to have, like, local experience because that's the only way how you can properly, like, kind of envision yourself and what is required for the local teams.
[00:31:03] And that's the only way how you can really help them, support them on the long term. It's about staying close. And if you're asking me if I'm missing the local day-to-day, like, I've very consciously chosen to kind of use all the local experience I've gained over the last years to kind of help people accelerate in this space. And that's just because I love to see other people grow.
[00:31:30] And I love also to inspire people in that way. So for me, it all kind of came together in this role. And yeah, the fact that Aala is also then allowing me to still pave the way and enable transformations like an omnichannel transformation internally is, yeah, it's the right mix for me, at least. I love it.
[00:32:21] No worries. Totally. Likewise. I mean, like, I don't know. I'm very Dutch. It's like, sometimes you can have been on the English, right? But no, it's been a pleasure being on the podcast and, yeah, contributing to the research and stuff like that. So, yeah, happy to help. And we truly got connected through the DSI because you reached out through an email I sent out to the community. So it works. Yeah.
[00:32:46] So I really appreciate you participating and being a part of the DSI and sharing all of your thoughts on all of our different channels. So thank you so much, Vivian. Thanks, Vivian. No worries. Thank you. Thanks again to Vivian for sharing Aala's work with us. Thanks for being part of our community. Thank you.