[00:00:00] [SPEAKER_00]: Welcome to Unpacking the Digital Shelf, where we explore brand manufacturing in the digital age.
[00:00:16] [SPEAKER_00]: Hey everyone, Peter Crosby here from the Digital Shelf Institute. The zigzag shopping journey of
[00:00:21] [SPEAKER_00]: the consumer has completely disrupted the organizational silos of brick and mortar versus
[00:00:27] [SPEAKER_00]: digital commerce at many brands. Driving growth requires cross-functional teams to pick Omnichannel
[00:00:33] [SPEAKER_00]: use cases and devise, launch, measure, and optimize them together. The fuel of that process is data,
[00:00:42] [SPEAKER_00]: and Andy Beilke, Sr. Development Manager of eCommerce Strategy and Capabilities at General Mills,
[00:00:48] [SPEAKER_00]: focuses his team on delivering the data that enables Omnichannel thinking and behaviors across
[00:00:54] [SPEAKER_00]: the organization. Andy joined the podcast to walk Lauren Leavak-Gilbert and me through
[00:00:59] [SPEAKER_00]: transformation of processes and data science that are driving growth.
[00:01:04] [SPEAKER_00]: Following this episode, you will want to Google the word Gonculator.
[00:01:09] [SPEAKER_00]: Andy, welcome to the show. Thank you so much for being with us today. We're excited to have
[00:01:13] [SPEAKER_01]: you on. Thanks Peter. Thanks Lauren. Really excited to be here. Yeah, it's so generous
[00:01:20] [SPEAKER_00]: for you to give back to our little DSI community. You sit in an Omnichannel role.
[00:01:27] [SPEAKER_00]: I think you refer to it as the Omnichannel Junction Box. Is that true? Did someone make that up?
[00:01:35] [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, it is. It's a unique role. My title is really the Development Manager on eCommerce
[00:01:44] [SPEAKER_01]: Strategy and Capabilities at General Mills for our North America segment. How I equate that
[00:01:51] [SPEAKER_01]: really being our Omnichannel Junction Box within our organization. What that means is that we need
[00:01:58] [SPEAKER_01]: to bring an Omnichannel mindset to both capability work but also solving business problems that our
[00:02:04] [SPEAKER_01]: commercial teams are facing every day. It's super important with the growth of eCommerce
[00:02:11] [SPEAKER_01]: and the CPG or in the food space to bring that insight into our organization and be kind
[00:02:17] [SPEAKER_01]: of that. We're that group that's kind of beating the drum on the importance of
[00:02:21] [SPEAKER_01]: eCommerce, digital transformation and what that means but then helping bring that to life through
[00:02:27] [SPEAKER_01]: really business application and connecting different teams to different solutions within
[00:02:33] [SPEAKER_01]: our organization to help them accelerate their business. Talk a little bit about that
[00:02:39] [SPEAKER_00]: shift to the Omnichannel mindset. Tell me about sort of how that merger, not finally,
[00:02:49] [SPEAKER_00]: I guess we're at that moment now where that seems to be happening. We're seeing that happening
[00:02:53] [SPEAKER_00]: but what was kind of the process to get it there for you? Yeah, I'll tell you first there's
[00:02:59] [SPEAKER_01]: still days where it doesn't feel like it's happening. Where I can tell some stories about
[00:03:06] [SPEAKER_01]: but yeah it's been a great evolution that I've been in this role for about three or three and
[00:03:13] [SPEAKER_01]: a half years now and the role has evolved itself and that's because I think the state
[00:03:20] [SPEAKER_01]: of the business and the business needs have evolved in regards to eCommerce and Omnichannel
[00:03:24] [SPEAKER_01]: and so I mean if you think back to 10 years ago when a marketing execution was
[00:03:31] [SPEAKER_01]: pushed from CPG manufacturers into the retail space it was all about activating in-store.
[00:03:41] [SPEAKER_01]: In-store is super important, it still is important and it will always be important but
[00:03:45] [SPEAKER_01]: now you need to have an Omnichannel mindset when you do that and enter new things like
[00:03:51] [SPEAKER_01]: retail media and different kind of avenues that start to add different elements to the equation
[00:03:56] [SPEAKER_01]: and it's just super important to have that Omni mindset as you're going to market
[00:04:01] [SPEAKER_01]: to ensure that you're maximizing your marketing investment to reach the right consumers
[00:04:11] [SPEAKER_01]: and capitalize on that. So our team is really trying to, I view this world as a bunch of
[00:04:18] [SPEAKER_01]: concentric circles. We historically look at things like functions, I actually sit in our
[00:04:24] [SPEAKER_01]: sales function by the way. I'm a sales person that is helping to just grow our brands and
[00:04:30] [SPEAKER_01]: consult with our brand teams and our retailer teams and our sales teams in doing that
[00:04:35] [SPEAKER_01]: but the reality is I don't view myself solely as that. I view myself as kind of like this
[00:04:41] [SPEAKER_01]: overlapping kind of functional expert in eCommerce but helping to contribute across
[00:04:47] [SPEAKER_01]: a variety of different spaces to help accelerate the business wherever I can.
[00:04:50] [SPEAKER_02]: I love the concentric circle example. As a visual person, I'm envisioning all these circles kind of
[00:04:55] [SPEAKER_02]: touching and intertwining but to that point how do you define Omnichannel in your organization
[00:05:02] [SPEAKER_02]: in order for all those different functions to feel like they have a vested interest in
[00:05:09] [SPEAKER_02]: the importance of it and the value it's going to drive for the business because I think you
[00:05:13] [SPEAKER_02]: can look at Omnichannel in different ways so I'd be curious to hear kind of how you define
[00:05:16] [SPEAKER_01]: that for your org to really get them on board. Sure, yeah it's not perfect. We have groups that
[00:05:24] [SPEAKER_01]: have more I'd say have an Omnichannel approach or maybe KPIs that are geared towards that
[00:05:32] [SPEAKER_01]: than others. We have our I would call tried and true maybe historical sales teams
[00:05:39] [SPEAKER_01]: for example that are well established and routinized at a lot of the in-store elements
[00:05:44] [SPEAKER_01]: think like regular Nielsen data and you know distribution shelving merchandise and kind of
[00:05:52] [SPEAKER_01]: like the old like that's like the the old retail model and it's still a really important
[00:05:55] [SPEAKER_01]: part of retail right that's always going to be the foundation but we have a group that
[00:06:00] [SPEAKER_01]: we've established over the last several years that in this body of work used to really exist
[00:06:05] [SPEAKER_01]: within my team but that's we've now kind of pushed it out into more field-based teams
[00:06:10] [SPEAKER_01]: that have that we we have Omnichannel sales managers for example and they have different
[00:06:16] [SPEAKER_01]: KPIs that they're also responsible for to help accelerate their business and so that will
[00:06:22] [SPEAKER_01]: introduce the digital shelf into that equation and so we have a framework for measuring success
[00:06:27] [SPEAKER_01]: and you know so my team helps bring those capabilities together and kind of define what
[00:06:34] [SPEAKER_01]: the KPI should be and then helping kind of troubleshoot opportunities against them
[00:06:38] [SPEAKER_01]: in conjunction with all the commercial teams and our tech teams not a perfect science but
[00:06:42] [SPEAKER_01]: that's kind of where we're at. I hope I answered that question adequately but that's
[00:06:47] [SPEAKER_01]: it's really an evolution and our sales team is I'd say at the forefront of it because
[00:06:53] [SPEAKER_01]: they're interacting with our retailers every day and that's where this transformation is
[00:06:58] [SPEAKER_02]: So you're sitting in sales but this also incorporates supply chain, R&D, marketing obviously,
[00:07:07] [SPEAKER_02]: I'm sure shopper so how do you stay connected with them? Like are you having and the reason
[00:07:14] [SPEAKER_02]: I'm asking this is because for most brands it's hard to kind of be able to bring all
[00:07:19] [SPEAKER_02]: those functions together so how have you found it to be successful whether it's weekly meetings
[00:07:24] [SPEAKER_02]: or different cadences or sprints or I'd be curious to see how your team can kind of enable that
[00:07:29] [SPEAKER_01]: across the org? Yeah great question we've done a lot of different things over time.
[00:07:35] [SPEAKER_01]: One of the things that has was established before I was a part of this team and lives
[00:07:41] [SPEAKER_01]: on is really just a regular kind of a monthly cadence of we call it would just be e-commerce
[00:07:47] [SPEAKER_01]: best practice sharing and so my team organizes that every single month so this is a change
[00:07:51] [SPEAKER_01]: management initiative right like this has been a long-standing thing that we've been doing it's
[00:07:55] [SPEAKER_01]: very simple you're just getting together it's about getting people that have subject matter
[00:07:59] [SPEAKER_01]: expertise really related to e-commerce together it doesn't really matter where you sit it could
[00:08:03] [SPEAKER_01]: be North America retail which is my operating segment it could be our pet segment it could be
[00:08:08] [SPEAKER_01]: international we bring those groups together it could be a salesperson that works on a
[00:08:13] [SPEAKER_01]: customer or it could be an enterprise marketing team that supports capability development for
[00:08:19] [SPEAKER_01]: e-commerce driven or digital driven initiatives and so this is probably a hundred person
[00:08:23] [SPEAKER_01]: list that we get together every month and that's one really good example of how we do that
[00:08:30] [SPEAKER_01]: and we've had many other initiatives over time where we're either driving a certain
[00:08:37] [SPEAKER_01]: you know initiative or cadence that's kind of strategically driven like when we launched our
[00:08:42] [SPEAKER_01]: digital shelf measurement framework we had a change management plan that we created
[00:08:47] [SPEAKER_01]: we would plug that into our monthly meeting cadence of course but we had additional
[00:08:53] [SPEAKER_01]: additional communications and procedures kind of stood up around something like that to
[00:08:57] [SPEAKER_00]: put more of a bigger focus against it now Andy could you maybe walk us through the sort of the
[00:09:06] [SPEAKER_00]: before and after experience of not thinking how many or not needing to think omnichannel
[00:09:12] [SPEAKER_00]: 10 years ago or whatever and then what it looks like today I mean maybe through the lens of
[00:09:20] [SPEAKER_00]: some sort of tent pole event or some like big thing like you're all working on it can you
[00:09:25] [SPEAKER_00]: sort of bring that to life for our listeners a little bit of yeah I'd love to I mean 10 years
[00:09:30] [SPEAKER_01]: ago 15 years ago if you're doing a big marketing event a tent pole event it's going
[00:09:35] [SPEAKER_01]: to be so for us think like right now it's back-to-school season so you're going back
[00:09:39] [SPEAKER_01]: to school there's a you know big initiatives around that in retail stores across the country
[00:09:46] [SPEAKER_01]: and 10 years ago this is maybe 15 years ago this is about you know it's probably focused
[00:09:51] [SPEAKER_01]: on linear tv it's focused on more explicitly in-store display and it's almost the groups
[00:09:58] [SPEAKER_01]: that are coming together to execute that it's less cross-functional it's more a merchant
[00:10:03] [SPEAKER_01]: maybe with a retailer and or a little bit more linear I would say in terms of how it flows
[00:10:10] [SPEAKER_01]: you have a brand team developing a strategy they want to get into market this time our sales
[00:10:14] [SPEAKER_01]: team would be collaborating with a merchant at a retailer to bring that to life in store
[00:10:19] [SPEAKER_01]: and that's how it comes together in the modern world that we're in today if it's
[00:10:24] [SPEAKER_01]: an omnichannel event it needs to be significantly more cross-functional the players have changed
[00:10:29] [SPEAKER_01]: dramatically in how you do that I mentioned retail media earlier in the conversation
[00:10:36] [SPEAKER_01]: not only is in-store display still a component of that but now you have other ways to reach
[00:10:41] [SPEAKER_01]: consumers through you know retail platforms to be able to capitalize on your marketing
[00:10:48] [SPEAKER_01]: your marketing investment and and opportunities there and so the tax tactics have changed
[00:10:55] [SPEAKER_01]: the players have changed so now organizing around that is quite different where you have
[00:11:00] [SPEAKER_01]: a more collaborative or a more cross-functional group that you need to bring together but you
[00:11:04] [SPEAKER_01]: need to do it faster you know you need to do more real time because everything's changing
[00:11:07] [SPEAKER_01]: all the time so you do need to be more agile and and I would say we you know no
[00:11:12] [SPEAKER_01]: I don't think anyone's perfect in this regard our teams our commercial teams do a really
[00:11:16] [SPEAKER_01]: great job of collaborating with our our retail partners to bring these opportunities to life
[00:11:22] [SPEAKER_01]: it's just so different than it used to be used to be more of a one-size-fits-all approach and now
[00:11:27] [SPEAKER_01]: it's now it's it's much more of a personalized or tailored event data driven what are the
[00:11:33] [SPEAKER_01]: right marketing levers to pull through retail media networks customize more at the retailer
[00:11:38] [SPEAKER_01]: level than ever before much different than what it was 10 or 15 years ago
[00:11:43] [SPEAKER_02]: and what are you what are you doing differently to set yourself up for the next five ten right
[00:11:49] [SPEAKER_02]: because it's going to continue to change more channels some new social media network I'm sure
[00:11:54] [SPEAKER_02]: is going to come up or the way that in-store and digital work together I mean that part we
[00:12:01] [SPEAKER_02]: can't control right but we can control the part of how we operate or how you operate as a
[00:12:06] [SPEAKER_02]: business so I'm curious like what are you putting in place whether that's a process or
[00:12:11] [SPEAKER_02]: people or decision framework to really be able to make those changes so quickly yeah I mean
[00:12:16] [SPEAKER_01]: I'd say the first is leveraging I would say leveraging data that we have that we have access
[00:12:22] [SPEAKER_01]: to or finding access to to the next size tranche of data that we think would set us up for
[00:12:29] [SPEAKER_01]: something differentiated so data a data-driven strategy whether that's data driven marketing
[00:12:35] [SPEAKER_01]: or if that's just simply measuring your performance in the marketplace with with all
[00:12:40] [SPEAKER_01]: the data points that we have at our disposal so I would say that's probably where we're
[00:12:46] [SPEAKER_01]: at right now in that space retailer specific data things like walmart luminate or or stratum with
[00:12:53] [SPEAKER_01]: kroger or your 8451 you know different data sources that are retailer unique
[00:12:58] [SPEAKER_01]: that can provide a differential insight into the consumer I think is is definitely something
[00:13:05] [SPEAKER_01]: that we've got a great strategy around and have been investing we've really been investing
[00:13:10] [SPEAKER_01]: that for a long time and I think it's only accelerated in recent years and then that data
[00:13:16] [SPEAKER_01]: it's important that you put that you that we monetize it ourselves right that we then use
[00:13:22] [SPEAKER_01]: it and turn it into insight and create an advantage with that so that's really the next
[00:13:27] [SPEAKER_01]: opportunity for us and finding a more routinized way to do that is something that kind of my
[00:13:32] [SPEAKER_01]: team sits at the center of and we don't have a perfect process or strategy for that yet today
[00:13:39] [SPEAKER_01]: but we've got some ideas on some places that we are exploring to better kind of maximize
[00:13:44] [SPEAKER_01]: accelerator insights into decision making faster with with the new data streams that
[00:13:51] [SPEAKER_00]: we're getting access to I am loving this new word routinized so it's new to me at least I
[00:13:58] [SPEAKER_00]: love the routine plus eyes and you've turned it into a verb
[00:14:04] [SPEAKER_00]: it's it's uh it's my new favorite word so first of all thank you for that
[00:14:08] [SPEAKER_00]: the second thing is I know that uh you know data kind of feels like the data that you're able to
[00:14:15] [SPEAKER_00]: produce for folks who are trying to make these decisions faster stronger smarter is really your
[00:14:20] [SPEAKER_00]: currency I think that it's it's your uh it's the way you are able to hopefully attract interest
[00:14:29] [SPEAKER_00]: and engagement and to sit down at the table to have a common vocabulary am I right in
[00:14:35] [SPEAKER_00]: this currency or is it does it scare people does it do they not want to hear from you because that
[00:14:39] [SPEAKER_00]: involves perhaps even more accountability or or um transparency that they might be concerned
[00:14:45] [SPEAKER_00]: about and you don't need to necessarily apply that to general mills but I'm thinking as
[00:14:49] [SPEAKER_00]: somebody that's that's uh thinking about how data can uh be this currency how do you how
[00:14:56] [SPEAKER_00]: do you think about uh how that's how getting people on board of that sort of data train if
[00:15:03] [SPEAKER_01]: yeah I love that phrase did I I do fundamentally believe that data is one of the new currencies
[00:15:08] [SPEAKER_01]: that we that we are now uh we're in we're in that world now um being um uh that that is
[00:15:15] [SPEAKER_01]: what digital transformation essentially I think creates or maybe a byproduct of that and it
[00:15:21] [SPEAKER_01]: changes and it evolves how you need to go to market and think um from a commercial perspective
[00:15:26] [SPEAKER_01]: um for us I would say or maybe broadly speaking um I think it's important to uh know
[00:15:38] [SPEAKER_01]: maybe balance the right amount of data that you're trying to pursue and look for and
[00:15:45] [SPEAKER_01]: maybe bring into your organization and focus on the problems that need solving because there's
[00:15:51] [SPEAKER_01]: data out there for everything now and and the reality is it's all getting expensive and so
[00:15:58] [SPEAKER_01]: you're going to need to prioritize you're going to you're going to need to budget for what is
[00:16:02] [SPEAKER_01]: most important for you to get get the work done that that you need to do and so something
[00:16:07] [SPEAKER_01]: I'm I'm finding myself doing and then internalizing but also coaching many different
[00:16:13] [SPEAKER_01]: partners inside and outside of my organization on are always focusing on the problems to
[00:16:18] [SPEAKER_01]: over the use cases for that data don't lose sight of that people talk about AI a lot AI is um we
[00:16:25] [SPEAKER_01]: could probably talk about that in a second here but AI itself is really I don't I try not to
[00:16:29] [SPEAKER_01]: talk about it too much because it's really less about AI it's more about what's the right
[00:16:34] [SPEAKER_01]: solution to the business problem that you're facing and if AI is a part of that great like
[00:16:39] [SPEAKER_01]: I think it can accelerate that for sure if it's the right part of the solution
[00:16:43] [SPEAKER_01]: but we've you know we've been getting calls from many different retailers on
[00:16:48] [SPEAKER_01]: just blanket how could we how could they use you know looking for for maybe some coaching on
[00:16:53] [SPEAKER_01]: how to leverage AI differently within their ecosystem and I think that's the wrong question
[00:16:56] [SPEAKER_01]: to ask I think it's well what are the problems that you're trying to solve and can AI be
[00:17:00] [SPEAKER_01]: part of the solution so yes I hope yeah I'm pivoting around a little bit not trying to
[00:17:06] [SPEAKER_01]: be dodgy or anything but I hope that helps go no I think focusing you know we often talk
[00:17:11] [SPEAKER_00]: about the problems to be solved the jobs to be done whatever it is because then that
[00:17:16] [SPEAKER_00]: focuses the conversation very clearly and it's not just some email dump into my email inbox
[00:17:24] [SPEAKER_00]: every Monday with some sort of list of things but rather it's coming I presume to them in
[00:17:30] [SPEAKER_00]: the context of this thing we're all trying to achieve does that definitely capturing it
[00:17:37] [SPEAKER_01]: yeah and especially in a world where you know in the CPG or in the food space where I work there's
[00:17:43] [SPEAKER_01]: the the business environment has changed dramatically from even just two years ago
[00:17:48] [SPEAKER_01]: the the the growth momentum from kind of the pandemic you know driven at home eating
[00:17:56] [SPEAKER_01]: consumption driven behavior has started to slow and so our the dynamics of our business have
[00:18:01] [SPEAKER_01]: have changed pretty quickly the state of the macro economy is different the state of the
[00:18:05] [SPEAKER_01]: consumer is different and what that's leading to is more you know more value seeking behavior
[00:18:11] [SPEAKER_01]: in different things and that's putting pressure on branded companies in general as
[00:18:16] [SPEAKER_01]: consumers maybe trade down or find different alternatives to maybe brands they know and
[00:18:20] [SPEAKER_01]: love maybe they'll try that private label product that they you know is a little
[00:18:23] [SPEAKER_01]: cheaper but they'll give it a shot that type of that type of situation so as a result
[00:18:29] [SPEAKER_01]: the momentum of our business has started to change and that's when the prioritization
[00:18:34] [SPEAKER_01]: of things like investment in data versus retail media versus other things that that a brand has
[00:18:41] [SPEAKER_01]: to decide on becomes really really important on how you do that and so going all the way back to
[00:18:47] [SPEAKER_01]: being focused on the problems that you need to solve is really critical and having that
[00:18:51] [SPEAKER_01]: alignment I think all the way to the top within your organization can be really really helpful
[00:18:56] [SPEAKER_01]: so that when that time comes when your pnl gets pinched you're prioritized against the
[00:19:01] [SPEAKER_01]: right things everyone's aligned and then you can move forward together for better or for worse
[00:19:06] [SPEAKER_02]: whatever that direction is and andy how have you seen I know covid was kind of a crazy time for
[00:19:13] [SPEAKER_02]: everyone especially in e-commerce and changed the growth numbers and you saw a huge increase
[00:19:17] [SPEAKER_02]: because people were buying online how have you kind of leveled out your expectations of what
[00:19:25] [SPEAKER_02]: what you're selling online versus what you're selling in store what that balances and what
[00:19:28] [SPEAKER_02]: kind of future projections of what growth looks like in e-commerce because obviously that has kind
[00:19:34] [SPEAKER_02]: of pendulum swung a bit and as someone who's focused on the pnl and making sure that you're
[00:19:39] [SPEAKER_02]: driving that growth and profitability how have you as a as an org as a function tried to think
[00:19:45] [SPEAKER_02]: about what success looks like now and like in the future for that yeah I love the question
[00:19:51] [SPEAKER_01]: I think our you know initially no one really knew what to expect you know and and maybe about
[00:19:59] [SPEAKER_01]: two-ish years ago or so things started to somewhat normalize um uh normalize I don't
[00:20:08] [SPEAKER_01]: know that there's been a normal year in like the food space in or in the last five but like
[00:20:16] [SPEAKER_01]: uh you know uh but yeah I don't know what no one I don't think anyone knows what normal is I
[00:20:21] [SPEAKER_01]: guess we're in the new normal but every year is presenting a different challenge and some of them
[00:20:25] [SPEAKER_01]: are quite extreme from what the year before might have been um and so it's it's flexing
[00:20:32] [SPEAKER_01]: the the the org agility of of everyone in in in the industry going back to the original question
[00:20:40] [SPEAKER_01]: on on e-commerce as a growth driver and how to maybe reframe that within within the context of my
[00:20:47] [SPEAKER_01]: organization again we focus on a lot of the external data points and our internal data
[00:20:51] [SPEAKER_01]: points and we use that to really triangulate um a forecast a plan a long-range plan of what
[00:20:58] [SPEAKER_01]: we think uh could be true and all that data that we invest in we bring into that um that
[00:21:06] [SPEAKER_01]: gonculator if you will to try to come up with a bit of a prediction of where we where we see the
[00:21:12] [SPEAKER_01]: market going and you know we really I think earlier this year on one of our investor calls
[00:21:19] [SPEAKER_01]: you know we released that general mills we we are from like an e-commerce percent of business
[00:21:23] [SPEAKER_01]: or development perspective about mid teens is what our development is online which is pretty
[00:21:28] [SPEAKER_01]: for a food player and and so we know that we over index relative to the industry so we have
[00:21:36] [SPEAKER_01]: a lead which is great and so that's a that's a critical data point but we that's part of our
[00:21:41] [SPEAKER_01]: narrative like we need to keep that lead and how do we maximize and continue to um uh
[00:21:48] [SPEAKER_01]: capitalize on the growth opportunity so it's again leveraging data but then using it to
[00:21:52] [SPEAKER_01]: that to life to our senior leaders within our organization quantifying it here's the size of
[00:21:59] [SPEAKER_01]: the prize if we continue to go this route um you know newsflash for branded cpg right now
[00:22:05] [SPEAKER_01]: not much is growing right right now in that space except for e-commerce and so it is so
[00:22:13] [SPEAKER_01]: important in my mind I know I'm biased from where I sit but it's so important to be on the
[00:22:22] [SPEAKER_01]: so that's the narrative that that I am I am on right now obviously as I talk talk it talk it
[00:22:29] [SPEAKER_01]: out loud to everyone I hope it sounds sounds okay but uh it's leveraging data bringing that to
[00:22:34] [SPEAKER_01]: life through you know really quantifying the opportunity and then getting it to the
[00:22:39] [SPEAKER_01]: right places in your organization to help uh help help keep kind of keep the eye on the
[00:22:44] [SPEAKER_02]: prize for people and how are you telling that story to your leaders right because I think
[00:22:49] [SPEAKER_02]: most cpg companies have leaders who have potentially just been focused on in store for
[00:22:56] [SPEAKER_02]: the majority of their careers and they might not understand e-commerce so what has been helpful
[00:23:02] [SPEAKER_02]: to kind of tell that story to get more resources more funding to be able to support
[00:23:07] [SPEAKER_02]: your mission statement which by the way sounded excellent uh I'm kind of like how you're
[00:23:11] [SPEAKER_01]: about e-commerce yeah I mean what has been helpful I would say the the trajectory that
[00:23:22] [SPEAKER_01]: leaders have seen so the results from e-commerce I think has been really helpful I think the
[00:23:30] [SPEAKER_01]: the bit one of the biggest challenges that we actually have that starts to be this concentric
[00:23:35] [SPEAKER_01]: circle that overlaps with this world really fast is retail media because unpacking the
[00:23:43] [SPEAKER_01]: effectiveness of that media spend versus media national media spend or a broader consumer buy
[00:23:49] [SPEAKER_01]: that a that a brand team had been doing and then reallocating that investment towards something
[00:23:54] [SPEAKER_01]: like search which is a lower funnel conversion activity becomes really difficult to do
[00:24:00] [SPEAKER_01]: and that's where this all starts to come together so that's a little bit deeper than that broader
[00:24:07] [SPEAKER_01]: maybe c-suite conversation it's more at call it the the brand decision level or the pnl level
[00:24:13] [SPEAKER_01]: that a brand needs to do but that's that's where that's where we run into challenges
[00:24:19] [SPEAKER_01]: frankly how do you how do you compare running a bogo at publics versus running a search
[00:24:28] [SPEAKER_01]: on walmart versus doing this thing at instacart or door dash in the intermediary space that you
[00:24:34] [SPEAKER_01]: know it's just so difficult to be able to coach teams across those different levers to drive
[00:24:40] [SPEAKER_01]: their commercial business and keep a consistent performance narrative and things like that it's
[00:24:47] [SPEAKER_01]: very difficult to do well solve that would you we're gonna working on it working on it
[00:24:56] [SPEAKER_00]: about 40 of my closest peers no i mean that therein lies the the amazing challenge for the
[00:25:05] [SPEAKER_00]: gonculator as you put it thanks for bringing that great vocab yes yeah i know i love these
[00:25:11] [SPEAKER_00]: but brings me back to my hokan's heroes childhood which dates me uh anywho um that's
[00:25:19] [SPEAKER_00]: what i think is the the you know we in in the business that we're we think about
[00:25:24] [SPEAKER_00]: attribution and how do you know where can you double down what's and and it's become increasingly
[00:25:30] [SPEAKER_00]: difficult to do that and way more complex i would imagine and so the fact that you and 40 of your
[00:25:36] [SPEAKER_00]: favorite peers are working on that every day is exciting yeah definitely yeah i mean for
[00:25:44] [SPEAKER_01]: for us i think the recipe for the future is having a lens to like you know leveraging data
[00:25:54] [SPEAKER_01]: have a lens into where we see growth opportunity ensuring that you are adequately setting up the
[00:26:02] [SPEAKER_01]: right strategy to support that perhaps that is trying to distort resources that direction
[00:26:09] [SPEAKER_01]: perhaps that is trying to build different capabilities uniquely in different areas that
[00:26:16] [SPEAKER_01]: more growth to come from perhaps that is changing your business processes to better
[00:26:25] [SPEAKER_01]: integrate e-commerce or bring that to life somehow you know all these things
[00:26:31] [SPEAKER_01]: uh all these things are being pursued by many different organizations to try to get after
[00:26:35] [SPEAKER_01]: that opportunity so that's probably not like a a huge secret or anything like that but
[00:26:39] [SPEAKER_01]: for me the future is really it really is omni-channel we you know i i sit in a team that
[00:26:45] [SPEAKER_01]: is we specialize in a lot of different things but i see what peer play does i see what
[00:26:51] [SPEAKER_01]: omni-channel retail does i see what amazon has been trying to do breaking into food over the
[00:26:55] [SPEAKER_01]: last decade really unsuccessfully and they're doing some good things right now but there
[00:27:00] [SPEAKER_01]: will be a limit to what they're able to accomplish without a stronger omni-channel
[00:27:04] [SPEAKER_01]: footprint so to me i think the future of this world is really omni-channel and people don't
[00:27:12] [SPEAKER_01]: they i don't know if they'll ever be super familiar with someone else picking all their
[00:27:16] [SPEAKER_01]: produce and dropping it on their doorstep it's just kind of the reality of food it's
[00:27:21] [SPEAKER_01]: it's more personal than that and people like to be more involved in that uh and there of
[00:27:25] [SPEAKER_01]: course are exceptions to all these things that i'm saying but i think that's the reality
[00:27:29] [SPEAKER_01]: and so the faster you can get to operating effectively in that omni-channel mindset i
[00:27:35] [SPEAKER_00]: think the better off you will be yeah walmart and morning consult put out a report recently
[00:27:41] [SPEAKER_00]: on a survey that they ran against i think 2200 consumers asked a bunch of questions to sort of
[00:27:48] [SPEAKER_00]: get at the what they call the state of adaptive retail it was a really really cool
[00:27:54] [SPEAKER_00]: report because it it's really focused on the future the hyper-personalized future of
[00:28:02] [SPEAKER_00]: of retail and what it will take to be able to deliver almost i think essentially every part
[00:28:10] [SPEAKER_00]: of the consumer journey in a hyper-personalized way how they discover how they get inspired how
[00:28:16] [SPEAKER_00]: that you know all of that all the way through how they get it and then hopefully how they
[00:28:20] [SPEAKER_00]: rebuy it again and i feel like data is going to be the only way that any of that works
[00:28:29] [SPEAKER_00]: is if you're able to do this data and then you also own the omni-channel experience or
[00:28:35] [SPEAKER_00]: as a brand that you are able to play across all of those things and so looking at that and
[00:28:41] [SPEAKER_00]: thinking about what they're trying to describe here it to me it's a clarion call for thinking
[00:28:47] [SPEAKER_00]: about this in a different way and that you have some time to get that worked out but you don't
[00:28:53] [SPEAKER_00]: have all the time in the world to get that worked out yeah i like that there is i think
[00:28:58] [SPEAKER_01]: there is a ticking clock um you know i i don't think i can disclose maybe our percentage of
[00:29:04] [SPEAKER_01]: business on like e-commerce at walmart but it's it is growing dramatically if you look
[00:29:09] [SPEAKER_01]: at their earnings reports for north america and you focus in on maybe if you can find some
[00:29:14] [SPEAKER_01]: food facts and things like that ecom is all over all over there same with kroger right like
[00:29:20] [SPEAKER_01]: this is this is the talk of the investor community in that space aside from ai of course
[00:29:26] [SPEAKER_01]: and technology but um and those things connect they connect really well right in a digitally
[00:29:32] [SPEAKER_01]: transformed retail ecosystem those things connect and can can benefit each other so to your
[00:29:39] [SPEAKER_01]: on leveraging data to essentially refuel your marketing refuel your approach to how you reach
[00:29:46] [SPEAKER_01]: your consumer is really really important for the future of retail and that's what i think
[00:29:52] [SPEAKER_01]: omni that's what i think will give omni-channel retailers a leg up i think how to reach them in
[00:29:57] [SPEAKER_01]: store in a personalized way is where i'm becoming more and more curious i think you're seeing
[00:30:02] [SPEAKER_01]: more of that experimentation happening which is really fascinating but it's essentially
[00:30:06] [SPEAKER_01]: it's kind of the flip of what's happened during covet where digital disrupted or the need to push
[00:30:13] [SPEAKER_01]: towards an online experience disrupted the the retail marketplace so quickly i view it a little
[00:30:19] [SPEAKER_01]: bit more like the opposite now it's going to be more of like digital technology and transformation
[00:30:25] [SPEAKER_01]: is going to be completely disrupting in-store retail in a different way through through this
[00:30:32] [SPEAKER_01]: so it's going to be fun to be a part of it and fun fun to watch uh mostly i'm sure it'll
[00:30:37] [SPEAKER_01]: be a little painful here or there but as we as we figure things out but i think it's going to
[00:30:42] [SPEAKER_01]: be i think the next three years are going to be really telling as you said as you said
[00:30:48] [SPEAKER_01]: there is you have some time but not a lot of time yeah that's the thing that the pace
[00:30:53] [SPEAKER_00]: of change that seems to be on the horizon with ai i just feel like it's just going to
[00:31:01] [SPEAKER_00]: become an onrush because right now i would say you know gartner has their trough of
[00:31:06] [SPEAKER_00]: disillusionment you know and i feel like ai i don't know if you were aware of that so
[00:31:10] [SPEAKER_00]: when you're in sas software they sort of talk about the adoption of technology
[00:31:14] [SPEAKER_00]: and there's i've forgotten all the stages but one of them after you have like the oh my gosh
[00:31:19] [SPEAKER_00]: this is so exciting you know the hype cycle they call it i think okay and then and then
[00:31:23] [SPEAKER_00]: and then so they have all these expectations and then it drops into what they call the
[00:31:28] [SPEAKER_00]: of disillusionment which is just one of my favorite things i've got this noted to you
[00:31:34] [SPEAKER_00]: yeah exactly and and i think ai is actually going to be somewhat of
[00:31:41] [SPEAKER_00]: drops into the trough of disillusionment quickly and then back up to expectation like i don't
[00:31:45] [SPEAKER_00]: because i think it's going to the use cases are going to come at us so quickly that
[00:31:53] [SPEAKER_00]: and then we'll discover oh this really doesn't help me as much as i was hoping
[00:31:56] [SPEAKER_00]: would help me but the next one will i just it's going to be a very interesting time to be
[00:32:01] [SPEAKER_01]: in the business the good news is that uh you know i just googled trough of disillusionment
[00:32:06] [SPEAKER_01]: and according to their search results which are driven by ai according to what they're posting
[00:32:11] [SPEAKER_01]: to me it's given me a really good overview of this topic in a synthesized way excellent
[00:32:16] [SPEAKER_01]: so thank you for the tip yeah i do i do agree with the premise that it should mean it will
[00:32:21] [SPEAKER_01]: be a faster dip into the trough and then back out yes but then then it will be a continuous
[00:32:29] [SPEAKER_00]: circle back into overhyped expectations down into the trough and back up again so it's
[00:32:36] [SPEAKER_00]: exciting times and again thank you so much for coming on to to sort of share that journey with
[00:32:44] [SPEAKER_00]: us that you're on it's it's super exciting and inspiring because where what the the relationships
[00:32:52] [SPEAKER_00]: that you're putting together at general mills to move forward in this omni-channel way i think
[00:32:59] [SPEAKER_00]: are setting the bar for the industry and so learning about it from you is just uh really
[00:33:05] [SPEAKER_01]: valuable and we're really grateful well yeah thank you for having me i hope uh i hope maybe
[00:33:10] [SPEAKER_01]: that's listening it's a nugget out of this conversation that they can take away i certainly
[00:33:15] [SPEAKER_01]: have a few from our from our conversation as well including this trough of disillusionment
[00:33:21] [SPEAKER_01]: use it i like it i like it thank you very much for having me i i really appreciate and
[00:33:26] [SPEAKER_01]: appreciate everything that uh the you know dsi and and falsify have done to help bring this
[00:33:32] [SPEAKER_01]: community together uh you know uh in recent years thank you you are really kind thank you
[00:33:37] [SPEAKER_00]: thanks so much andy thanks again to andy for sharing all of his wisdom and vocabulary
[00:33:43] [SPEAKER_00]: if you're looking for more wisdom swing on over to digital shelf institute.org to become a member
[00:33:48] [SPEAKER_00]: thanks for being part of our community